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Welcome! This is the place to ask the community of experts and other fallacyophites (I made up that word) if someone has a committed a fallacy or not. This is a great way to settle a dispute! This is also the home of the "Mastering Logical Fallacies" student support.


Dr. Bo's Criteria for Logical Fallacies:

  1. It must be an error in reasoning not a factual error.
  2. It must be commonly applied to an argument either in the form of the argument or in the interpretation of the argument.
  3. It must be deceptive in that it often fools the average adult.

Therefore, we will define a logical fallacy as a concept within argumentation that commonly leads to an error in reasoning due to the deceptive nature of its presentation. Logical fallacies can comprise fallacious arguments that contain one or more non-factual errors in their form or deceptive arguments that often lead to fallacious reasoning in their evaluation.

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Carol Joy

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Carol Joy


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About Carol Joy

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Tue, Apr 09, 2019 - 04:12 PM

Again, a conspiracy theory that is not baseless but is reality

Yesterday i tried to get a reply from you that examined only the logical argumental side of an aspect of an issue. However you are so blindsided by the brainwashing on that the particular issue, vaccines, I am concerned with that my query was not examined in light of what I needed to know.
So I will switch issues as far as topic of issues but continue:
What does an individual do when they are aware - not of a baseless conspiracy - but are involved in trying to point out the truth of a matter, that is, a conspiracy that is actually on going, and would be provable if only the society would accept it.
So let's say we are living in some type of post-plague society. Although we are still able to use computers, on a local basis and have somewhat of a news media, although most of America and the world's infra structure is gone.
After all of the plague years, all of us here at LF are living Salem New England. We start to notice that local preachers are putting forth the notion that some of the local residents are not aligned with the forces of good, but are heathens under the influence of Satan.
The situation becomes so inflammatory that some of the residents, especially those who are not Church goers and who have a lot of wealth in terms of land and stored foods, are especially attacked by the preachers. There is shunning that starts to happen, as the congregations of various preachers will no longer trade with them, or talk to them. Luckily in the group of those being shunned are some fine doctors and nurses, so we who are being shunned do possess a rather decent level of health. And again, we are better fed and have more of the things this post-plague society now considers desirable.
Now there is a higher authority down in Washington DC that would address the situation, and send in troops to help us. It is especially good to think about this, as already some of us have already been arrested for being Satanic worshippers and are now in jail. If found guilty of being Satanic worshippers, we will be hanged by the neck until dead.
Efforts to send messengers down to Washington DC begin. Several of us mount our horses and travel down there, but when we arrive, we find out that we are not to be deemed important enough to be talked to, as the inner circle of Washington politicians and bureaucrats will only talk to elected officials. (It is possible some here think one possible upside of a plague taking out much of our society might be that this plague would also take out all of DC, but in this reality, that did not occur ;-) )
So all the elected officials in Salem are Church goers. Previous to the inflammatory persecution of people, some of the elected officials in Salem were "our people" but they were the first ones to be arrested. As people who are considered Satanic heathens, their statements would be discredited, by the DC politicians and bureaucrats Besides that, immediately after arrest, they were stripped of their elected positions the moment they were resigned. We certainly cannot get them to listen to us.
s we try to explain our plight to local DC news people, the response from the politicians and bureaucrats who ignored us is this one: "You are conspiracy theorists."
Well, yes we are indeed that - but we are not baseless conspiracy theorists but actual witnesses to the situation and the situation is a fully verifable conspiracy.
What is also interesting is that local people in Washington DC come up to us and shyly explain that they have relatives living in Richmond VA and the outskirts of Pittsburg PA who are dealing with the same catastrophic situation. And they are finding they have no one to turn to.
So we go back to the very politicians and bureaucrats who initially dismissed us and explain "Look, it is not just happening in Salem where we live, but also in Richmond and in Pittsburg." We bring with us legal depositions of all the people who say this is happening in other places.
The reply from the bureaucrats to us then is that this is merely anecdotal.
##############
This is the situation many of us who investigate products face. The story of MTBE is the exact same story - there were over 900 studies that showed the priodcut was safe, and only one study showing it was not safe. The account of so many people who suffered harm from being exposed to MTBE were dismissed as anecdotal. Even though there was proof that the polymers that seal gasoline tanks at gasstations were being eroded by MTBE and thus getting into drinking water, that was dismissed by experts. Luckily Gov Davis listened to the millions of Californians who had made this into a part time career. We activists sat in committee hearings in Sacramento, wrote legislators faxed and phoned.
And so Gov Davis appointed a man named John Froines to head up the MTBE Blue Ribbon Panel.
Much of what happened is summarized here:
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2008/6/22/540267/-
Froines' panel found that the risk to benefit of MTBE was nil - the substance wwas all risk and no benefit. They felt if they hadn't faced a serious timeline they might have actually proven the substance ws carcinogenic.
So MTBE was semi-banned, with gasoline no longer being mandated to having 9 percent MTBE in its formula. due to Daavis listening to his panel. Diane Feinstein was furious,a s MTBE is basically a waste product her husband Richard Blum could be involved with, and deals of a lucrative nature would have been made if the product continued to be put into Calif's gas. Trumpe dup charges went forth against Davis - he gave up his career as governor to protect us. Ahnold was put into office through many manipulative activities that Di Fi engaged in. But that episode in my history has well instructed me as to the Salem we all now live in, be it the statins causing ALS or the vaccines that are killing our babies.



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Bo Bennett, PhD
Author of Logically Fallacious

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Bo Bennett, PhD

Author of Logically Fallacious

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About Bo Bennett, PhD

Bo's personal motto is "Expose an irrational belief, keep a person rational for a day. Expose irrational thinking, keep a person rational for a lifetime."  Much of his charitable work is in the area of education—not teaching people what to think, but how to think.  His projects include his book, The Concept: A Critical and Honest Look at God and Religion, and Logically Fallacious, the most comprehensive collection of logical fallacies.  Bo's personal blog is called Relationship With Reason, where he writes about several topics related to critical thinking.  His secular (humanistic) philosophy is detailed at PositiveHumanism.com.
Bo is currently the producer and host of The Humanist Hour, the official broadcast of the American Humanist Association, where he can be heard weekly discussing a variety of humanistic issued, mostly related to science, psychology, philosophy, and critical thinking.

Full bio can be found at http://www.bobennett.com
Print Tue, Apr 09, 2019 - 04:18 PM
For the benefit of the other responders, before answering, please see Carol's original post that she is referring to and my response right below it: https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/bg/Bo/LogicalFallacies/UqIFDDHA/Top-Five-Logical-Fallacies-in-the-Social-Justice-Movement.
Bo Bennett, PhD
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William Harpine, Ph.D.

Seasoned Vet

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William Harpine, Ph.D.


Seasoned Vet

About William Harpine, Ph.D.

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Print Tue, Apr 09, 2019 - 04:36 PM
There is a distinction between real conspiracies (like Watergate, the Mafia, etc.) and what Brian Keeley calls "unjustified conspiracy theories."

However, I think that, in general, real conspiracies don't stay secret very long before someone talks.

On a larger note, experts tend to be right much more often than they are wrong.


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